Some VT Observations..

[streamer]

Torben, a great job and very easy to use. Here are some observations, not sure if bugs or just operational issues on some of them.

1) If the A audio is less than 10 secs, when you hit VT RECORD START, it plays all the jingle, you voice, but then in Mix Editor, it seems to have slid the beginning of the Voicetrack to later. I can slide then but doesn't match what happened in the VT Window. If I select a new play point on "A" then it behaves.

2) In the VT Window, I wonder if the column order should be "A", "M" then "B" to indicate more of a natural progression. Thoughts?

3) Having the track title and artist for "A" and "B" (by the waveform) would be useful for when you suddenly forget what the track is 

4) In Config, "Voice Tracking/Adjust Player Volume" is unchecked but I can adjust the sliders in the VT Window and it does add the envelope points

5) In Database (mAirlistdB) the two "Import new voicetracks recorded in......" checkboxes.I see no operational difference with them unchecked or checked. I still get a dialog offering me to Import and close after I hit Save in the VT Window. Is there a way to hit SAve and then bypass that dialog.

6) Still experimenting with the normalize and Compressor options in the VT track but wondering if it may be good feature to auto-apply when you move to the mix-editor rather than have to do each time manually?

Great first impressions and very happy. Is it a long term goal that you can adjust timings etc from within the VT Window without having to go via Mix Editor?

Much appreciated, Richard

[Torben]

1) Confirmed. This only happens when the A item has no Cue In set. mAirList tries to set Start Next to the beginning of item A (position 0.000), which doesn't make sense, because position 0 means "not set" in the mAirList world. Start Next should be set to a single millisecond into item A in this case. Will be fixed in b1404.

2) Good point. I was thinking about that but could make up my mind. What do the other people say?

3) Also a good point. Above the waveform? Somewhere else?

4) If the option is unchecked, mAirList will still record the fader movement, but the volume for A and B won't be adjusted during recording. This is for the people who use a digital mixing desk - and its physical faders - for VT. If mAirList reduced the volume, it would be reduced twice (once by mAirList and once by the desk fader). - On a site note, I have made this work for my Barth D.MAX mixer: I can move the physical faders, their positions are reported to the software via the serial bus, and the volume sliders in the VT dialog move accordingly. I plan to add support for Lawo and DHD as well, I just have to check how to retrieve the fader positions in those protocols. (I have also purchased a Velleman K8055 kit yesterday, which offers two analog inputs - let's see if I can build a low cost VT interface from that.)

5) Hmmm. I turned the option off, and no dialog pops up anymore here.

6) That's on my to-do list.

7) I originally planned to put the VT functionality directly into the Mix Editor, so you can record and mix from the same window. But it turned out to be too complicated, at least for the moment. Maybe later.

[streamer]

2) I also wonder if A,B & VT is better (as M may not be just Mic, but you may be using a sub-bus to feed the inputs as I do etc.)

3) I'm thinking just below, as I think that's where my eye goes (like a caption) but again, as long as it's somewhere 

4) OK, That makes sense.

5) I'll play with it again and see what happens.

Thanks

[streamer]

Couple of updates.

4) I had the "Adjust Player Volume" checked and when I moved the slider down or up, no noticeable difference in my headphones. Seemed to remain constant volume.

5) Had both options unchecked (Playlist Window and Playlist Editor) and in the Playlist Windows, when I hit "Save" after I have recorded whatever takes, I still get the "Import" windows that offers me the options for entering into the database.

Another idea...

On the volume sliders by Player A and B, can I see the dB as I move the slider?

Thanks

[Torben]

4) Will check that.

5) Will check that too. In the playout window, ok.

Volume slider: The original Windows control doesn't support that, unfortunately. You can display the raw value, but internally it's using a linear scale from 0 to 100. I would have to reinvent the wheel and rewrite the fader/slider control from scratch. Or find a suitable 3rd-party component.

[Cad]

You can display the raw value, but internally it's using a linear scale from 0 to 100. I would have to reinvent the wheel and rewrite the fader/slider control from scratch.

I feel sure there's some fairly simple logarithmic formula that could be used to convert 0-100 to a reasonably accurate dB scale?  Similarly, the slider position (with a suitable text scale) could likewise be calibrated in dB?  So for example, each 5% of slider movement would 'equal' 3dB, with 100 = 0dB, 95 = -3dB, 90 = -6dB, and so on.

Just my 2p worth.
--
BFN
Cad

[Torben]

Windows sliders are always linear. In the VT recorder example, the values 0 (top) to 100 (bottom) are used, and mAirList converts these linear values to logarithmic dB values as you move the slider.

The point is that, while Windows can automatically display a tooltip/hint for the slider, but it will always display the raw, linear value. There is no way to display any other text, e.g. the logarithmic dB value calculated from the linear slider position. (According to some forum discussions I found on Google, there must be some trick, but I haven't made that work.)

On a side note - the conversion isn't as simple as Cad is describing it. When you look closely at the scale of a physical mixing console, you will notice that the scale isn't linear (in terms of dB values) at all: Just compare the distance of a, say, 12 dB step, at the top of the fader scale, and at its bottom. You will notice that the distance is much bigger at the top, allowing for better precision when controlling the volume in that area.

Peakmeters (unless with a simple British 0-7 scale) are pretty much the same: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aussteuerungsmesser#Ausf.C3.BChrung_in_anderen_L.C3.A4ndern

mAirList uses a similar scale for all volume sliders and peakmeters.

[Charlie]

How are you getting the AutoCue "dB" settings, then? Wouldn't that be a similar formula conversion for what's being asked here?

[streamer]

The point is that, while Windows can automatically display a tooltip/hint for the slider, but it will always display the raw, linear value. There is no way to display any other text, e.g. the logarithmic dB value calculated from the linear slider position. (According to some forum discussions I found on Google, there must be some trick, but I haven't made that work.)

Personally I'm not worried about the value as a tooltip, but a label near the slider will suffice. All I need to see is a integer value relative to the top of the slider (assume top is 0dB attenuation). If I drag down, then I can see whether I have -4, -7dB etc. It helps a lot when I start Player 2 (B) at reduced volume.

[streamer]

I did some extensive show work last night and used VT extensively. Some other observations.

1. Can you make the VT Window (& Mix Editor) positions "session-sticky". I would open the VT window and have to move it every time above my cartwall. It would be great to have the position remembered. It can be a session sticky rather than ini file written.

2. Maybe an option for forcing the Mix Editor when you save a VT. Sometimes I hit OK when I meant to go into the Mix Editor. Could be even be a checkbox on the VT dialog so it can be changed at will.

I will say, my productivity was a lot faster with the VT tool, so looking forward to the next alpha/beta.

[Torben]

Finally made the tooltip work in b1406.

The window was supposed to remember its position, but something was wrong. Will be fixed in b1406 as well.

Mix Editor - hm. You mean something like "Ask for confirmation when a take is selected that hasn't been reviewed in the Mix Editor"?

[streamer]

Mix Editor - hm. You mean something like "Ask for confirmation when a take is selected that hasn't been reviewed in the Mix Editor"?

Or just go straight to the Mix Editor if not reviewed (option of course).

Good news on the Tool tip. 

[streamer]

Thanks for the Tooltips with dB. Works well.

4) I had the "Adjust Player Volume" checked and when I moved the slider down or up, no noticeable difference in my headphones. Seemed to remain constant volume.

5) Had both options unchecked (Playlist Window and Playlist Editor) and in the Playlist Windows, when I hit "Save" after I have recorded whatever takes, I still get the "Import" windows that offers me the options for entering into the database

4) Still doesn't work, but I discovered the option does not appear to get saved. In Configuration, I check it, click on Save, re-launch Config and it's unchecked. What's the INI entry and so I can try and add manually?

5) Still get the "Import File" dialog after hit Save in VT even though unchecked for the database. 

Thanks, Richard

[Torben]

Both issues will be fixed in b1407.

[streamer]

4) I had the "Adjust Player Volume" checked and when I moved the slider down or up, no noticeable difference in my headphones. Seemed to remain constant volume.

Still doesn't save on b1407. I check it, "Adjust Player Volume" in the Options tab of VT in config. Save, re-open Config and it's unchecked.